Legal CEPT Prefixes for UK Countries

Notices
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I have been seeing quite a number of SOTA activations spots recently with prefixes of G/, GW/ and GI/. Please not that although these prefixes are the traditonal prefixes for UK DXCC, such prefixes cannot be used for radio amateurs who reside outside of the UK when they visit the UK to operate some amateur in the UK. Please see list below list of UK countries along with tradional DXCC prefixes and the legal CEPT prefixes also.

England - DXCC prefix is G (this prefix cannot be used by radio amatuers who reside outside the UK when visiting England) - Legal CEPT prefix is M (this prefix is the one to be by radio amatuers who reside outside the UK when visiting England)

Wales - DXCC prefix is GW (this prefix cannot be used by radio amatuers who reside outside the UK when visiting Wales) - Legal CEPT prefix is MW (this prefix is the one to be by radio amatuers who reside outside the UK when visiting Wales)

Scotland - DXCC prefix is GM (this prefix cannot be used by radio amatuers who reside outside the UK when visiting Scotland) - Legal CEPT prefix is MM (this prefix is the one to be by radio amatuers who reside outside the UK when visiting Scotland)

Northern Ireland - DXCC prefix is GI (this prefix cannot be used by radio amatuesr who reside outside the UK when visiting Northern Ireland) - Legal CEPT prefix is MI (this prefix is the one to be by radio amatuers who reside outside the UK when visiting Northern Ireland)

Isle of Man - DXCC prefix is GD (this prefix cannot be used by radio amatuers who reside outside the UK when visiting Isle of Man) - Legal CEPT prefix is MD (this prefix is the one to be by radio amatuers who reside outside the UK when visiting Isle of Man)

Jersey - DXCC prefix is GJ (this prefix cannot be used by radio amatuers who reside outside the UK when visiting Jersey) - Legal CEPT prefix is MJ (this prefix is the one to be by radio amatuers who reside outside the UK when visiting Jersey)

Guernsey - DXCC prefix is GU (this prefix cannot be used by radio amatuers who reside outside the UK when visiting Guernsey) - Legal CEPT prefix is MU (this prefix is the one to be by radio amatuers who reside outside the UK when visiting Guernsey)

Jimmy M0HGY

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Jimmy

Whilst your post is factually correct, what effect do you expect it to have? Is the MT planning to disallow SOTA contacts made using an incorrect or illegal callsign? We may understand the nuances of the UK rules, but what about more distant administrations? Should we disallow similar contacts not involving the UK? Who will enforce the decisions? Will any sanctions be back-dated? Be very careful about opening cans containing worms!

73 de Les, G3VQO

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It seems perfectly reasonable to remind people of the rules. Since the callsigns used were not ambiguous it’s a minor infringement. But it would be better if operators got it right.

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Hi Les,

Personally I am not to sure if SOTA activators using incorrect UK prefixes would invalidate their SOTA activations in the UK or not. Personally, in my opinion it would make sense to invalid such SOTA activations because the prefix being used is not legal and I’d any SOTA chases made to SOTA using incorrect prefixes should be invalidated as well because they chasing a SOTA activator who isn’t using a legal callsign.

Jimmy M0HGY

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I think it is a good reminder for those who want to play radio in the UK.

73 de Martin / HB9GVW

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In theory it should as it’s not a valid call sign.

If you operate out of band should you be able to claim the QSOs? We have people regularly operating on 14.350 USB which places them out of band should we disallow those QSOs? What if a US visitor calls on 222MHz (legal US illegal in UK) and just happens to find another US visitor who has a dual band dual watch handy that opens up on 222MHz and they chase each other, is that more illegal than 14.350 USB or signing G/X1XXX when you should be MW/X1XXX?

They are all examples of illegal operation but we probably all think the 222MHz example worse than 14.350 USB worse than call sign error.

However, it would be considered a harsh punishment to ban the call sign error.

The problem with CEPT is both amateur misunderstanding and local licencing office misunderstanding. It should be really, really simple and straightforward. Government agency decides to sign up to CEPT, rules for the country appear in TR61/01. Amateurs obtain and read TR61/01 and use what is written. Then licence conditions change in country and nobody at licencing authority gets TR61/01 updated. e.g. you can pass your full licence in the UK and can choose an unissued G call, or reissued lapsed G call or just accept next in the M0/M1 sequence. So we are now issuing G and M calls. Does that mean G/ is as valid as M/ for CEPT. Logic suggests yes but TR61/01 stills says M/ etc.

Worse amateurs are terrible for learning the rules have changed and using new rules. Or they insist on modifying rules for local use and custom. e.g. EJ is the prefix for island operation off the Irish (Eire* ) mainland or for a special station. But there are people who cannot read the words and think EI is valid on an island. Of course these people don’t understand the PA effect of unusual calls on making people chase them. I’ll bet I’ll be 60dB more chasable as EJ/G4LLD/P than EI/G4LLD/P.

* is Eire still the valid name or is it just Ireland now?

Well as I’ve written we’re unlikely to invalidate call sign errors but maybe we should post something to mildly embarrass the operate so they don’t make silly mistakes again. If you had 4 QSOs on 14.350 USB as your only QSOs for an activation I believe that should be deleted partly because it shows you have no clue about what you are doing.

The best thing it can have is caused some debate and make people just go and check what the rules are before they go CEPT activating. And for about the next 25-40 posts it will remain on topic before it drifts into the price of fish in Djibouti or such or some eejit posts an out of context 80s cartoon gif.

If it makes people think first then it’s good. I know that I almost need a piece of laminated paper with a list of things to do on the summit stuck to the radio like “operate on band X mode Y”, "turn on 2m handy dual watch 145.400 / 145.500, “set 705 power out on 432MHz to 9% for transverter operation”, “check 705 power for normal 432MHz QSO”. And, of course, “play recording of numbers station if bored and nobody wants a QSO” :wink:

So mainly it will create hot air on here. But if just one person is more accurate when on the air it will be somewhat useful hot air.

Those are my opinions, and if you don’t like them… well, I have others.

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It’s about proportionality. Several things might be against the rules but some are worse than others.

Out of band so bad.

Not even close so bad bad.

Still a UK prefix and still obvious who is transmitting. Only a little bad.

Eire is the Irish for Ireland. When speaking English you should call it Ireland.

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I think the more likely thing to happen is not using the regional secondary locator (W,M,I for Wales, Scotland , N.Ireland etc).

I know it is not requirment for UK amateurs, but I am not 100% sure for visitors under cept. A quick search suggests that it isnt required.

So a more global approach would be use M/XY9ABC and add the W/M/I/J/D/U etc if are familiar with RSLs.

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Look in the doc the latest TR61/01 I can find has Annex 2 dated Oct 2020 and it shows using the RSLs for CEPT ident. Therefore visitors have to use them to operate under CEPT. You do what the CEPT docs say because that is what each country agreed to. Now the fact that Ofcom in the UK has not had the docs updated means you are still EXPECTED to use the MW MM MD MI MJ MU M .

'tis not the science of rockets :wink:

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https://docdb.cept.org/download/4541 has Annex 2 dated Feb 2024. And therein lies one of the problems - finding the current relevant document! :wink:

Personally I’ve found that the actual CEPT T/R 61-01 doesn’t always match locally recognised operating practices. An example is Spain, where the CEPT document says we should use the prefix EA/. In practice, when I was operating with a local amateur, he recommended using the appropriate (optional) digit denoting the province (such as EA3/ ).

The German Amateur Radio Club, DARC ( English version - DARC ), seems to have a more user friendly version or summary here

That’s all a slight detour from Jimmy’s original subject. He’s correct in what he says, and CEPT certainly seems to suggest that the RSL isn’t optional for visitors to the UK

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17811286312285789000087350188983

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I am yet again seeing SOTA spots from overseas visitors to the UK where the DXCC Gx/ prefix is being used rather than the legal Mx/ prefix is being used. I was like to remind overseas visits to the UK once again that under both the UK licensing conditions and under CEPT, it is NOT legal to use Gx/ and you must always used Mx/ when operating in the UK. If you resides overseas and plan to do amateur radio operating in the UK, please read up on both CEPT and UK Licensing condition before doing so.

Jimmy M0HGY

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It ain’t simple, is it? The first time I visited the USA, it took me ages to find the US prefix list. Last time, not so bad. Next time, I’ll ask google.

  • When operating amateur radio as a visitor in Florida under a reciprocal or CEPT agreement, you should use W4/ followed by your home call sign (for example, W4/G1ABC).

I wonder how we coped before the internet?

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We was ‘iggerunt’ and we was 'appy. :slight_smile:

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My first licence, back in the Dark Ages, was several sheets of foolscap (remember that?) with the licence conditions printed in full. I wish I still had it, but I had to return it a year later when a revision was issued. I memorised that dam’ screed while I was building my first rig, so no excuses back then - plus there was an annual visit from a Station Inspector who even scrutinised your log to make sure you stayed on the straight and narrow and signed every entry!

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Jimmy, a useful reminder.
As summarised by the RSGB along with the relevant references:

73 Peter GM7STP

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Indeed. And when the inspector spotted I’d been working crossband to my friend Peter, a full licencee who was operating on 10m, I got a right roasting! Outside of the terms of my then Class B licence apparently.

In a way I can sympathise with those incorrectly using Gx/, as generally UK licencees have been referred to as “Gs”. It doesn’t arise for operating in the States where USA licencees have been referred to as “Ws”.

As for the use of a numeral alongside the country letter such as EA3/, no matter what rhe CEPT documents says, I reckon it is helpful to include the numeral. I didn’t have anyone tell me I was signing incorrectly when I operated as I5/G4OIG/P or as SV8/G4OIG/P.

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Because no-one cares. :sweat_smile:

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