Hi guys! Here in Brazil we use Ethanol since the seventies as an important energetic matrix. 1/4 of our car fleet are empowered by ethanol motors.
In a discussion about #6 of the 3.7.1 rule of the general rules (that forbids the use of fossil-fuel generators of any kind) in our SOTA WhatsApp group people asked about ethanol generators which is very specific, although very common to us.
If the decision of not using fossil-fuel is due to concerns about climate changes and other ecological matters, ethanol-fuel should be out of range of that, as it is somehow climate-friendly as the sugar cane plantations absorve tons of CO2 from atmosphere rather neutralizing pollution that ethanol motors may produce.
That being said the question is simple: may an activator use an ethanol generator during an activation?
Yes I’m sure you are correct providing you use pure methanol with no petrol added. Rule 6 only prohibits fossil fuels to power the station on the summit. It does not prohibit using fossil fuel derived electricity to charge a battery at the foot of the mountain prior to ascending and activating. On the summit using fuel cells is OK but of course the hydrogen would have to be obtained by hydrolysis and not the commercial stuff derived from fluid from oil wells.
Vegetation derived ethanol should be allowable regardless of whether it is converted to electricity by fuel cell, steam engine or turbine or internal combustion engine.
Rule 6 is specific about fossil fuels. If it meant something else it would say so.
Anyone who says you cannot use sugar cane derived ethanol devices needs to elaborate imo.
Hi Ron, thanks for the elaborated answer. A priori this is a theoretical question because I don’t think someone will really use such a generator as batteries are much more practical and lighter, but Brazilian ham pals are very “creative”. In our discussions we came to the conclusion that the rule would be talking about combustion motors in general and if that is the case the text should be changed. Let’s see what the managers board says.
You may be right but I think It would be much better for some of the original team to elaborate on what was intended.
The issue could be clarified by stating what are unacceptable means of generating electric power on a summit. If it is merely fossil fuels then any means using renewable liquid or gas would be acceptable. If it is also internal combustion engines then that must be clarified.
That was exactly what I had in mind when I wrote the preamble of the question, as ethanol/methanol was very specific to Brazil. I suspected that what was intended to be said is related to combustion motors in general as you’ve just said.
At the end the problem is just the geopolitical eurocentered vision… Anyways we’re very happy that SOTA spread around the world such as the “aqueducts, sanitation, roads, medicine, irrigation, wine”… and Monty Python.
Thank you guys for clarifying this! In that way, maybe the text of the rule should be modified.
Thanks Andy,
I think you need to talk with other members of the MT re an update of the Rules. Internal combustion engines running off renewables should be specifically mentioned if they are banned. At the moment Rule 6 does not say this
Methanol powered motor generators may never be common in England but SOTA is now global.
If it’s the noise of the little motor generator that is a worry then SSB should be banned and headphones mandatory to avoid disturbing the peace. On the other hand modern Japanese motor generators are quiet.
BTW Methanol fuel cells can be bought right now. A handy 8A at 12V can be had for around $8k. Less than the cost of an Icom linear.
More expensive than solar cells but works at night. And is virtually silent.
There has been conscious effort over the past 10 years to make things less UK and European in outlook. This includes using simpler forms of English when writing rules so that the translation into other languages is easier for both people and also for tools like Google Translate. Yes, it needs changing especially since we welcomed Brazil into SOTA.
Once upon a time (1930s ?) my grandparents had a gas-powered radio, when they had no electricity in the house. As far as I know it ran by the gas flame heating a thermal pile to approximately 6V, then generating the HT with a vibrator like those in early car radios.
Wish I had it now, it would be fun to play with, but my Dad junked it in the 1950’s !
I suspect my grandparents actually had the outboard “power supply” and separate radio, rather than an integrated model - they certainly weren’t rich. At that time they lived in Hunslet, having just moved out from Belle Isle in Middleton, where they had neither gas nor electricity (or water) piped in.
by stating what are unacceptable means of generating electric power on a summit. If it is merely fossil fuels then any means using renewable liquid or gas would be acceptable. If it is also internal combustion engines then that must be clarified.
Anyways we’re very happy that SOTA spread around the world such as the “aqueducts, sanitation, roads, medicine, irrigation, wine”… and Monty Python.
