Regarding sending your callsign twice or tuning up on frequency. Well as an experienced SOTA activator (and I include that adjective because it took a few years before I got to the stage where I could “manage” my callers as I do now), I simply put “offenders” to the back of the queue. Even if someone is ignoring what I am asking for and trying to bully their way to a quicker QSO, I am competent enough at CW these days to continue completing QSOs underneath all the QRM, so those who insist on calling more than once, or keep calling when I’ve called someone else, or called a partial that doesn’t match anything in their call - they definitely go to the back of the queue!
Same with those tuning up on the working frequency. As pointed out above, it’s really easy to identify the culprit - and they too go to the back of the queue. They all get worked eventually though - I don’t hold a grudge hi!
Now with regard to LOTW, the problem here as I see it is the cumbersome process of setting up new stations for every different location - which is over 100 different places every year for me. So I’m afraid I also adopt the OBK approach and have one station location set up for each DXCC I operate from (it is set up as G/SP-015 for G - so will still be correct for many thousands of QSOs hi!).
A flip side to this comes from activators who don’t send their own callsigns often enough. When I’m chasing I like to be sure of the activator’s callsign over the air before I call in. Sometimes the first hint I get that I’m actually listening to a SOTA activator’s pile-up and not some other one is when the callers subside and the activator finally drops back into a CQ, and if it’s fast CW I probably won’t catch it all the first time I hear it. There have certainly been times when I’ve discovered the pile-up on the spotted frequency is actually another operator elsewhere who’s replaced the SOTA one spotted…
Hi Jeff, SOTA promotes operating from varying locations (as do many other OTAs or indeed any /P or /M or even /A). I certainly haven’t said anything to discourage use of LOTW and I join you in advocating good operating practices. Beyond that my advice stands. It’s a free world and I won’t lose any sleep if my advice is followed or ignored.
73
I’ll add a relevant comment …
My CW pileups are always very big and getting bigger all the time. This is great! SOTA is catching on and pileups will get bigger over time. I look at this as a great challenge and it makes me a better operator trying to manage it. I normally work the strongest signals first and the weaker ones towards the end. I’ve noticed that some stations tune slightly higher or lower than my zero beat frequency. Sometimes this is an advantage for them to get through sooner – not always though. I think chasers also like the challenge of getting through sooner than later!
Many times I’m already responding to a station while several stations are sending their callsigns – perhaps they were sending it twice or just delaying their response. Either way once I think I have enough characters of a callsign I’ll start transmitting. One response to EA2IF’s comment…on my last early activation I had many EA2 stations calling and it was tough pulling out enough characters to respond in the way you suggested. Doing that I would have had several EA2 stations responding together again. I prefer to get the whole callsign first and then continue the QSO. I realize contesters do things differently but I’m not a a contester .
One final comment. Many of us put a high priority on S2S contacts. So I do want those stations to send “S2S” several times and I have no problem if they send it delayed from the rest of the callers. Most chasers will back off if they hear “S2S”, although not all will hear that station.
In any event, I really appreciate the growing number of chasers and the bigger and bigger pileups. I certainly don’t want to discourage any station from calling me. So much fun trying to work everybody!
Maybe that’s how it should be - first come, first served. The others in the pileup already know (or should know) the activator’s callsign so he/she should work through the current chasers (without wasting time telling them something they already know). Then send QRZ or CQ de callsign to invite latecomers. If I hear a “?” or “QRZ?” at any time, I send my callsign.
Obviously, if the pileup goes on for a long time, the occasional re-sending of activator’s callsign is appropriate.
Yes, sometimes things get tricky. I remember copying more than one HB9 or more than one DL, so getting back to that preffix only will surely produce various stations coming back to me. But not the whole pile-up and hopefully just 2 or 3 stations at the same time, so I usually can pull out a single callsing or part of the suffix out of that pico-pileup of 2 or 3 stations for me to finally call to just one.
I definitely like better the warmer, more personal and nicer exchanges in a SOTA QSO, rather than those faster but impersonally colder exchanges of the contest style. SOTA QSOs take a bit longer, yes, but they are nicer and we are not really in the rush and stress of a contest, fortunately.
73,
In response to WA6MM… I agree with your comments Brad. We are not contesters and for good reasons we do things differently. For instance, we send realistic, yes valuable, signal reports and provided the WX is kind and we have electrons to spare in our batteries we “NEVER LEAVE THE PILEUP”
Maybe it’s just me but the initial “E” sometimes throws me if sent just once. It helps if “de EAxyz” is sent.
Something not mentioned so far is, when many callsigns are sent at once, I can often pick out the one sent at slower speed - my brain can separate it from the others. And since it’s slower, often the last 2-3 letters are heard clearly because everyone else has finished sending. So I can reply “xyz?”
Getting back to the original subject of calling twice to an activator, I’ve been paying special attention to it during my chases yesterday and today. I send my callsign once or twice depending on:
1- how well I copy the activator, with which I make a guess of how well the activator will copy me. Sometimes I get quite low reports from activators in EU, even lower than the ones I’m giving them.
2- how big the pileup is.
3- my perception of the activator skills about picking up callsigns.
4- whether the activator knows my callsign because I’ve chased him before.
5- whether my internet signal, through which I send to and receive from my remote station is being patchy/jerky or not.
There may be other aspects but these are the main ones I can thing of now.
This is another good reason why sometimes I’m sending my callsign twice.
I know this but its helpful that you mention it. I had noticed this before, particularly in contests when in running mode. If we transmit the EA preffix without adding DE or CQ or having pushed the PTT or TX button before, it’s possible that the delay of the relays switching my station (in this case) to TX are not fast enough and the initial E gets lost.
Other possible cause is that the relay on the receiver side (your side in this case) hasn’t had the time to switch back to RX after your last transmission if I responded too immediately after you last transmission. I’ve noticed this several times, not only in contests, but also when activating SOTA. Some stations start calling too early and by the time my rig gets back to RX after my transmission, I find their callsign is already in process of being sent and I have totally lost their preffix.
I had to adopt certain strategies to try to avoid these sort of the former problems when I was doing contests, but avoiding the latter ones is out of my action. It’s the chasers who have to relax and not respond even before the activator had finished his transmission. When I’m chasing, I often hear other chasers doing this.
Yes, as well as varying slightly the frequency to produce a distinctive lower or higher tone makes the signal easier to be filtered out by our brain, a different speed, either slower or faster, produce the same effect. Also, the slow sending callsigns take longer to be sent and thus they may still be sending the last part of it when the rest of the other faster callers have already finished sending theirs and are quiet, so that final part can be perfectly copied by the activator.
I also upload every contact to LoTW and make the effort to ensure that the grid for my SOTA contacts (and for my VHF+ rover contacts) is correct. Unlike Pete I only have one location in TQSL labelled SOTA, I edit the grid for that location before I upload the contacts from an activation to LoTW. It takes me about 30 extra seconds per activation. I figured out how to make that work with my logging software early on. I was very glad as I was able to give some rare grids to regular SOTA chasers during the 2018 ARRL Grid Chase.
But, to each his own. As others have mentioned LoTW participation or accuracy has nothing directly to do with SOTA.
This is certainly the right place for the LOTW issue. It is an unintended consequence of SOTA and it is SOTA operators who are doing it. The object is to educate those doing it, they may not know what is happening. There is text about not trespassing or making sure you are prepared and capable to undertake the summit you have planned, but nothing about this. I am surprised that , this Community, when made aware of a problem in it’s ranks doesn’t want to do something to fix it. Doesn’t that go against the Amateur spirit.
Maybe an acticle in the SOTA Newsletter will help.
Never in the history of mankind and amateur radio has there ever been such a wise decision made such that SOTA awards need only your log. No QSLs (real or electronic), no corroborating logs. Just your log.
This doesn’t mean we don’t check, we have our ways.
…