Query G/CE-006

Old Reflector
1

Hi All;

I have just worked G4WTB/P on 40m CW who had alerted for G/CE-006.

A reverse beacon spot was also present with the same summit reference.

I double clicked on the Summit Reference link and it brought up Aconbury Hill never before activated.

After working him and he had gone qrt I came to log the contact only to get the message not a “valid summit on the date logged”.

Sure enough when checking the summits list I found that the list of CE summits only goes up to CE-005.

A search through reflector topics revealed a G/WB-024 Aconbury Hill.

How was it possible that the alert and spot could be generated for a non valid summit which also seemed to have a summit data page ???
Was this summit perhaps deleted some time in the past ???

73 de Ken G3XQE

2

Hi Ken,

It is the same summit. It was originally, mistakenly, allocated in the CE region. This was corrected after only the early days of SOTA back in 2002, and allocated to the correct WB region and given the reference G/WB-024. No-one ever activated it as G/CE-006.

It could be that G4WTF selected the wrong reference for Aconbury Hill for his alert. In that case, a chase entered for G/WB-024 will be valid, and G4WTF will no doubt realise his mistake upon his return, and also enter his activation logs as G/WB-024. However, it could be that he is on one of the other G/CE summits, so worth checking when he returns.

Tom M1EYP

3

In reply to G3XQE:

Ken,

I think Aconbury was moved, probably about the same time as Black M0untain; in both cases before I started SOTA. ISTR finding it on the set of lists which include the deleted summits as well as the currently valid ones.

Alerting doesn’t require a valid summit reference so perhaps G4WTB made an error or was using an old list. Alerts for a non-existent summit are possible, allowing for activator indecision by alerting eg SW-0xx.

Thanks for recent contacts. Hope to speak again soon; maybe Thursday.

73,
Rod

4

In reply to M1EYP:

Thanks for your reply Tom, I thought it may be something like this.

see from QRZ.COM that his home QTH is Hereford so it could be that he is on a WB summit.

Unfortunately he has no email address listed so maybe he will respond to this post or I will keep an eye out for his log before logging the qso.

73 de Ken

5

In reply to G3XQE

Now spotted for CE-006 too.
Rod

6

In reply to G3XQE:

I have just worked G4WTB/P on 40m CW who had alerted for G/CE-006.

Worked but not in a SOTA sense. Try and log it. :wink:

A reverse beacon spot was also present with the same summit reference.

I double clicked on the Summit Reference link and it brought up
Aconbury Hill never before activated.

After working him and he had gone qrt I came to log the contact only
to get the message not a “valid summit on the date logged”.

Excellent, that bit of the database is working. You’re probably not in agreement.

Sure enough when checking the summits list I found that the list of CE
summits only goes up to CE-005.

How was it possible that the alert and spot could be generated for a
non valid summit which also seemed to have a summit data page ???

Well… at one time the summit was valid. That means there was once a CE-006. I’m not sure but probably SOTAwatch checks the summit you spot/alert is in its lists of summits but doesn’t check the valid to date.

Was this summit perhaps deleted some time in the past ???

It was. If you check the ARM for G you find this entry

"09-May-02 1.5 CE-006 deleted and replaced with
WB-024 (fixing initial allocation error)

If in doubt then only the database is considered to be correct (www.sotadata.org.uk).

Someone must have been using an 11 year old list. It’s one of the reasons that copying the data from SOTA websites is considered bad IF you don’t update your copies at least once/month. Copying the data is fine but if you let others make use of that data then you must keep it up to date or this kind of error will arise.

I’m not sure if you can claim WB-024 or not Ken.

EDIT: Ah, Tom seems to think you can.

Andy
MM0FMF

7

In reply to MM0FMF:
In reply to G3XQE

Now spotted for CE-001 too.
Rod

8

In reply to M0JLA:

In reply to MM0FMF:
In reply to G3XQE

Now spotted for CE-001 too.
Rod

Which I can’t believe is right either.
I’m sitting looking out the window at the summit of CE-001 (3 miles as the crow flies) and have not been able to hear him at all!
I’ve never NOT heard any activator of CE-001 on any HF band from here!

Pete

9

In reply to MM0FMF:

Hi Andy;

Well I did try to log it hence this query.

Perhaps be a good idea to remove the summit reference page ???

He has now been spotted as G/CE 001 by N4EX who noted in the comments that CE-006 had been deleted in 2002, so goodness knows where he is :slight_smile:

I will have to wait for him to respond to the reflector or search for his activation log when or if he enters it.

Thanks to every one for clearing the pint up for me.

73 de Ken.

10

In reply to M0JLA:

I think Aconbury was moved, probably about the same time as Black M0untain…

As Tom said, CE-006 disappeared and became WB-024 back in 2002. WB-001 became SW-041 quite a few years later and some of us were fortunate enough to activate it twice, though my OCD made me ascend it from the Welsh side and operate from the Welsh side on the second occasion, having done “the English thing” the first time around. :wink:

I just hope Ian doesn’t think he’s carrying out a first activation otherwise he will be disappointed!

73, Gerald G4OIG

11

In reply to G3XQE:

It appears that he is actually G4WTF, who is indeed Hereford based, so it could be either Aconbury or Cleeve Hill.

53,
Rod

12

In reply to G4OIG:

Gerald,

As it is the highest point in Herefordshire I insist on doing it from the English side, using the appropriate call-sign and. I fear, causing some confusion amongst the chasers. (And also to myself when I instinctively “correct” the prefix when doing the log.)

Doubt he thinks it a first; he was first on Pen-y-Fan.
73,
Rod

13

In reply to M0JLA:

Careful Rod, the OCD is catching… and as for prefixes, I often sign GM from home, especially after a few days away activating! :wink:

73, Gerald G4OIG

14

In reply to M0JLA:

In reply to G3XQE:

It appears that he is actually G4WTF, who is indeed Hereford based, so
it could be either Aconbury or Cleeve Hill.

53,
Rod

Hi Rod;

Yes a typo on my behalf, I have him logged as G4WTF/P.

Look forward to working you again on 40m

73 Ken

15

In reply to G3XQE:

Rich N4EX is hearing him on 30m… wonder what antenna both of them are using?

Andy
MM0FMF

16

In reply to MM0FMF:

In reply to G3XQE:

Rich N4EX is hearing him on 30m… wonder what antenna both of them
are using?

If I wasn’t aware of the limitations of my own antenna, I might have asked if there was a CE-006 stateside !!!

I have just heard him work Steve G1INK/P on 10m and I hear no other stations working Steve, so I guess he is probably rather well endowed on the antenna front.

Ken

17

In reply to G3XQE:

Ken,

I wasn’t actually hearing G4WTF/P on 30M. I simply wanted to call attention to the issue of G/CE-006 vs. G/WB-024 and could not enter a spot using CE-006 so I arbitrarily chose CE-001 which inadvertently added to the confusion. I am unaware of an alternate method to highlight an invalid summit. In this case RBN recognized the summit and the SOTAWatch summit database listed CE-006 as “not yet activated”, creating the appearance of validity. Examination of the G ARM dispelled this notion.

73 Rich N4EX

18

In reply to N4EX:

Well I was more interested in what G4WTF may have been using to cross the pond on 30m :wink:

I feel the need for a 30m challenge sort of along the lines of the PP3 challenge. In the PP3 challenge you had to make as many QSOs using a single PP3 disposable battery. I’m not sure what the 30m challenge would be yet other than an unofficial bit of fun. Points per km with a power used multiplier probably. But it all depends if anyone else is interested.

Andy
MM0FMF

19

In reply to N4EX:

Hi Rich;

Thanks for the information.

Just out of interest, I wonder what you are using as I hear you so often chasing the EU activators, with my 10m X10m backyard and Vee trap dipole at 6m, I only occasionally hear and work Stateside activators.

73 de Ken G3XQE

20

In reply to G3XQE:
The source of the problem looks to be that Ian posted his alert from his iPhone via SOTA Goat. That is using a “local” summit database that Rockwell WW1X has downloaded, which looks like it contains deactivated summits and there are thousands of them. He may need to explore options for ensuring his database has only current summits
Jim G0CQK