I know enough CW to do a SOTA activation or the CQWW contest. I know enough Spanish to order a paella in Tenerife and ask for the bill. And I then derive great enjoyment from both activities. What can possibly be “horrifying” about that?
What I find horrifying is all the old-hands seemingly trying to put people off getting into CW, rather than motivating and inspiring them 
[quote=“GI4ONL, post:23, topic:12306”]dedication to whatever method you choose[/quote]…with the proviso that you evaluate your progress and adjust that method if the evaluations show you’re making no progress. (In hindsight, it was obvious from my self-evaluation that Koch was getting me nowhere within two or three months of my starting, but I was stubbornly persistent, and hammered on with it for most of two years anyway. Result? Much frustration and two wasted years.)
[quote=“EA2IF, post:24, topic:12306”]What about organising a morse training course on the air?[/quote]A great idea, but it probably needs to happen at a relatively local level, and it’s well worth taking advantage of an “all modes” bit of band so that there can be both voice and Morse employed.
[quote=“MM0FMF, post:25, topic:12306”]the common fact was they were all capable musicians[/quote]While musical ability may be a help to some, I’m not convinced it’s always a help. I suspect musicians who play mostly by ear and memory may have an edge over musicians who mainly use musical scores.
[quote=“G4OBK, post:26, topic:12306”]I would consider taking part in such a scheme to provide on air CW receiving practice on HF at a practical QSO speed (e.g. minimum 12 wpm) if it was within the terms of my licence.[/quote]I figure there are ways of organising that, possibly by setting up a regular Net like the one run in VK. Of course there’s also the GB2CW special broadcast licence, but it’s not valid for two-way communication, so feedback would have to happen using the operator’s own call (probably after a broadcast).
73, Rick 5Z4/M0LEP
I suspect musicians who play mostly by ear and memory may have an edge over musicians who mainly use musical scores.
I’d disagree. Hearing something and instantly being able to visualise what it looks like in a form of written language, is surely a massive advantage here?
HI Rick
Any slow Morse radio transmission used by learners from GB2CW etc once or twice weekly would only supplement the receiving practice one would need to do by oneself - as I suggested earlier, 30 minutes per day at home with few days missed would be a good target to aim for. Practice, practice, practice as Cap suggested.
Don’t expect to make speedy progress unless you can keep it up almost daily, that was my own experience. The end goal is pure enjoyment - copying a message in Morse with 100% accuracy in your head is most satisfying being a self taught skill. You said the Koch method failed you after two years - but you failed to spell out how long you spent each day and how regularly you listened to the Morse. So how much time did you put into it? We’ve had this before on the relfector, operators saying they can’t master the code but not telling us how long they spent trying to learn the Morse on a daily or even weekly basis. As you have already got off to a good start completing 10 activations using CW in 2015 it should not take you long to improve greatly with daily practice in my opinion. Indeed I was one of those who worked you in CW when you were on DM/SA-001 Brocken in October.
You could try Tom’s method - go sit on a hill in this lovely weather we experience and learn Morse there operating. It might just work for you but I have to say as an old timer (who was offered a seat on the London tube recently by a young lass) I am very sceptical that you will get significantly further using that method than you are now, but every experience using the mode will help I am sure.
Good luck with it then and no more comment from me on the subject, we’ve heard it all before some a couple of years ago on the old reflector anyway. I would still be interested to know how much time you spent on that Koch method over the two year period you tried using it to improve though…
73 Phil G4OBK
I’ve written quite a bit about my Morse learning experience in various places. Some of it is linked from my QRZ profile, with this timeline being the core of it. On lcwo.net I still have 1249 attempts(*) at Koch lessons recorded, but that tells less than half the story as I deleted at least a few hundred early attempts, and I also tried using programs like G4FON and “Just Learn Morse Code” quite a bit over the two years or so I was trying to get somewhere with Koch. In that time I struggled to about lesson 16 or so, but it was (in hindsight) obvious by about lesson 6 that the learn-one-add-one process didn’t work as promised for me.
(*) Edit: attempts between 2011-03-07 and 2012-04-08
That sounds like being a composer, hearing music in your head and seeing how to write it, or at least that is part of how I used to compose (part because an idea comes with a host of variants and you have to select and reject). Anyway, I suspect that this conflation of musicianship and morse code capability is a red herring. In my case I learned morse code over fifty years ago and I know it now, I play sax and clarinet (and earned beer money at it), I sight read, I composed and arranged, I played jazz and had considerable range as an improviser - but I still can’t USE morse code without rapidly hitting a fatigue barrier. It feels as if I am not using the same parts of my brain for music and morse code, I suspect that mentally I am doing something wrong but have no clue how to correct it - and why bother, I much prefer to hear a voice than a code, it is more personal, I felt the same way when I tried and then abandoned PSK.
Brian
Hello everybody. I like a lot climbing and activating for SOTA, most frequently in HF-SSB and VHF-FM. I take the chance of this thread as I want to start activating in CW as well.
Sometimes I climb together with EA2BD Ignacio and EA2IF Guru, and last year EA2LU Jorge came once with us as well.
I feel envy when these colleagues sit around with their headphones on and then there, in the middle of a beautiful landscape, they feel like travelling to another galaxy. Nature, concentration, silence… I’m so jealous!
It been some time since I started learning CW. I do it with the help of software sometimes (lots of options to choose but little time to practise…), sometimes keying when on the car with the aid of a iambic with speaker that I use to send car plates as I travel (anyone overtaking me receives a qso from me, hi) , and sometimes humming posters on the street. Mi brain can encode nowadays but decoding is another story. They are two separate languages to me. How dificult os to decode!
I sometimes chase in CW. Doing the basic QSO is easy and I avoid huge pile-up. I can send between 14-18 wpm with ease. Reading spots is of great help to check the callsign when I move to the frequency. But I sometimes get a call by myself if I am on the frequency prior to have a spot available…
I have receintly started doing some SOTA activation in CW. Well, a few times only as I get very nervous. I take the chance of the current 10m challenge. I don’t raise an alert in sotawatch but some friends know I’ll be there and wait for me. I do that in summits of 1 or 2 points to avoid a big number of avid chasers.
Some time ago Andy MM0FMF found me and gave me a call. Wow! how stressed I was with that huge row of dashes altogether! I was so confused that I forgot my little skills unable to remember about SRI or AGN. I got muted. I’m so sorry Andy for that nut I’m ready for you on my next one!
I would like to suggest to novice CW activators that:
One last comment: what would you think -experienced sota mates- about a call like this:
‘CQ SOTA QRS CQ SOTA QRS DE EA2BSB/P K’ so that you would get warned that there is a nervous but enthusiastic CW-novice operator?
Thanks everybody to help me progressing with my CW learning process. 73
Thanks Ignacio EA2BD for translating my words!
EA2BSB Santi
I am using Morse Machine on my phone to learn the alphabet.
http://qrznow.com/morse-machine-android-app/
It works for me because it waits for the correct answer b4 playing the next letter
73
Mike VK6MB
Hi Santi,
If you feel nervous then sending QRS in the CQ call might help. But of course only poor operators will respond at a speed that isn’t very close to the speed you call at. So if 10 wpm is your comfortable receiving speed just call CQ at 10 wpm, not a faster speed.
If someone cones back at 20 wpm just ignore them and call CQ QRS SOTA again.
Some ops apparently think that sending fast is a mark of masculinity. However if the person they are calling is sending slowly then a fast speed reply is both dumb and impolite.
I know some have old bug keys that send very fast dots and to change that is not easy so they might chance a call at 30 wpm or whatever. My suggestion is that they have a straight key for QRS ops and use the bug for more experienced ops.
Good luck and may everyone match the beginners speed.
73
Ron
VK3AFW
HI Rick
It sounds like the methods suggested by others may be more beneficial to you than the Koch method you tried and which has undoubtedly failed you. I know little about that method of learning. In my day, (as us old timers say) I got most benefit from a Datong Morse Tutor which generated random groups of letters and numbers. Once I had the licence in 1982 having passed the 12 wpm morse test at Liverpool with the late Marine Surveyor Mr Jardine on 31/12/1981 (I came in as “Class A” as the licence was then called) I started using Morse every day in QSO. I did what Tom M1EYP does and operated in CW contests and rag chewing in CW with others for practice. Using it every day meant that within 6 months of getting the licence I was rag chewing at 18 wpm of well sent morse with a high degree of accuracy. Whether I am typical I know not and I was a younger man then aged 30, and things are easier to learn the younger you are. This was long before SOTA had been thought of and was done in the comfort of a centrally heated radio shack and not outdoors sat on a hill in all weathers. I could not learn morse doing that I have to say due to the discomfort and difficulty in turning out as regulalry as I would need to, to get enough practice.
You are obviously well beyond memorising the character sounds in the alphabet as you have had a good handful of CW QSOs logged in the SOTA database so I think it comes down to the old practice, practice, practice method of a suitable type which works for you for as long and as often as you can make the time to do it.
Best wishes with increasing your speed to a good level.
Phil G4OBK
If that’s the case, there’s nothing more fun or useful than using Morserunner as previously mentioned by Christophe.
I often run a quick session when I’m at a loose end. Even a 5 minute session brightens the day up 
I’ve created a callsign database from the “real” sota chasers in my logbook. It’s funny sometimes to hear people on CW that you have never worked in that mode 
You can customise the session to make it as hard or easy as you wish. With QRM,QRN and LIDS it makes it very realistic.
Here’s a SOTA session from earlier this morning.
Try it, you won’t be disappointed and you don’t have to leave the comfort of your home to work a pileup!
Pete
[quote=“G4OBK, post:50, topic:12306”]the old practice, practice, practice method[/quote]I suspect that’s the one exception to the “every bit of advice has it’s opposite”. The nearest to an opposite for it I can remember hearing is the “Koch could teach 12wpm Morse in a week” allegation. If he was teaching Morse in a week it must have pretty intensive, and there can’t have been much time for practice (except within the course time)…
The “use Morse a bit every day” tends to fall a bit flat at holiday season. this time it went even flatter, as I spent a fair bit of the holiday visiting my mother in hospital. So far I’ve only managed one CW QSO, but that’s partly because a lot of my radio time got put into operating 5Z90IARU, and partly because HF hasn’t been playing that nicely. (I spent half an hour calling CQ yesterday without being heard by any RBN skimmers.) Still a few days to go…
73, Rick 5Z4/M0LEP
If you wish a list with all the SOTA participants, updated daily, you can just download it from www.on6zq.be/w/index.php/SOTA/MasterDta . Just replace the default Master.dta file by this one.
Linux users can use VE3NEA’s Morse Runner under Wine.
That’s where you’re going wrong Rick. Some will tell you that you need determination and self-discipline to do that, but I won’t. I’ve taught in inner city secondary schools for too many years to believe that approach works for most people! However, the “do a bit every day” idea is an important one. It’s the main reason most kids master calculus at primary schools these days, yet struggle with their 3 times tables when they start secondary school after a 6 week holiday. Well, maybe…
The trick is, as Victor intimates, to find a practice activity that is just so enjoyable, compelling and rewarding, that you just can’t wait to do it again. For me, that was real cw SOTA activations at 10wpm. Of course having a summit I could activate on the way to or from work every day was helpful in this regard!
But anything will do - that has you enthusiastic for more. Maybe just get on the air and answer some CQ calls with basic exchanges.
Brian, I have to disagree about the red herring comment. But then again, music to me is more a branch of mathematics than an art form (as it was to Pythagoras, Bach, Cage, Zappa et al).
OK Rick - half an hour’s short wave listening to other operators using CW would provide better morse practice than 30 minutes calling CQ listening to your own callsign being sent . You are allowed holidays but you could maybe squeeze in a small daily dose of listening to code most days with the devices and learning methods we now have available No pain, and no gain, that is the way it is I am afraid. The pain becomes pleasure when you catch on though as your confidence builds, so keep your nose to the grindstone as often as you can, put the microphone away more and you will do it!
73 Phil G4OBK
Yes, I’ve heard this “branch of mathematics” meme before, but have never understood the relationship between the intense rationality of math and an artform where one unexpected tone can hit you like a sock full of wet sand, but different strokes…
Despite the closing remarks of my post 46, I emphasise that I have not given up on CW - who knows, I might surprise you yet on one of your activations, Tom!
Brian
You need to read Gödel, Escher, Bach by Douglas Hofstadter.
I can’t understand the difficulty here. There is a perfectly good YouTube video that covers the basics.
Oh, its a magnificent conceit of a book, but I’m afraid that in the end it adds nothing to understanding.
Brian
Are you sure you read the English version? 