A little bit of respect to activators (Part 1)

Hi Jarek,

I can only agree with you. It happened to me very recently, when I could hardly hear @VK5PAS among the big guns but one of them said: “DM7KN listen, VK is calling you!”. All of a sudden: SILENCE… and Paul came through with s33/r41. :smiley: I was very grateful for the hint and that the others were standing by for a moment. :heart_eyes:

Acutally, this made my day! :sunglasses:

73 de Peter, DM7KN

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That’s been my experience, too, Martin.

In the bigger world of ham radio operating I’ve always been impressed with DXpedition operators, big contest operators and the like who can handle a pile-up with grace, skill and aplomb. I’ve heard it said that we get the pile up we deserve and though I’m not sure I believe that exactly, there is some truth in it I think. I’ve always tried to follow the lead of those great operators that can really work a pileup.

One thing I have noticed is that the good ones all seem to have a smile in their voice. I know that sounds a little flaky, but it’s true. They sound like they are just flat out having a good time. These are they guys that made me think: gee that sounds like fun! I want to do that.

In my case it was Paul W6PNG that I first noticed on a SOTA summit having a really good time. I think I can blame Paul for getting me caught up in this racket :wink:

Anyway, If I find myself getting tense in a pile up, I try and step back and remember that I am doing what I want to do and have some fun doing it. … and smile.

Another country heard from
Eric KG6MZS

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With regard to the suggestion that chasers drop their power, it is worth remembering that a drop in power from 100 watts to 10 watts will reduce the signal by 10dB, less than two S points. This might be a help but a powerful signal may be more due to a good antenna system and favourable propagation than high power!

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We have had this topic many times! And our friend Guru has also addressed this many times.

Maybe it is necessary to bring it up again and again, because the SOTA group is growing - which is wonderful!

Basically, as an activator, I am not at all against stations with a lot of power, if they have a good operating technique. To this counts (no matter with which power) listen, listen, listen…
As an activator, I find it really helpful when people point out an S2S station to me. Sometimes I think I hear something and explicitly call out in cw … /P? Unfortunately, lately stations are calling in that have a “P” in their callsign… that’s not how it was meant.
If I am on the summit and know of QRP stations, then these are treated by me preferentially… as by the way also all stations of which I know that they do not have good antennas.

As a chaser I observe that it happens here as if there is something to win. Often I just listen for a while. I am always amazed when chasers call at the same time as the activator. Is that again lack of listening or the time delay in receiving with websdr? No idea!

If I as a chaser hear that /P stations or QRP stations call then I let my attempt be and simply listen… and rejoice with the participants, if a S2S succeeded. I believe, I made thereby still not one QSO less!

In all rule the activators work off all Chaser, which they can hear. (There are, of course, justified exceptional situations which must be respected). And does it not matter whether one is the 5th or 21st QSO as a chaser?

73 Armin

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Very wise, Armin.:+1::clap:

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true Martin, I think that to be a chasser, first you have to be a mountain goat
73

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Some don’t like QRP or understand that Activator is King.

72 Chris M0RSF

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True, but if that was the case it would also work well on receive and they wouldn’t end up calling all over the activator, which happens far too often!

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If in a pileup, and as an activator, I ask for s2s, portable or qrp stations only from time to time, it works sometimes, others not so well, because some ops just dont listen.

But in the in the overall it´s worth a try.

Paulo, CT2IWW

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If you had to be a mountain goat before you could chase SOTA would never have started!:smile:

Its worth bearing in mind that just under 70% of activators are also chasers, so some of those unruly chasers may also be activators…

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As my activations are usually on weekdays so I seldom get the crazy pile-ups that happen at weekends, and the S2S chances are somewhat lower, too. My CW isn’t great, and there have been a few occasions in my recent activations when it’s taken many minutes to complete a QSO at least partly because other chasers were getting in the way ( for instance, see this post and replies ). I do listen out for QRP and S2S chasers, but in my limited experience the callers who cause trouble are also ones who don’t listen to requests giving partial calls or other limits that should exclude them. It seems my options in that situation are to:

  1. Try to work other callers while ignoring them, and hope they get the message
  2. QSY and pick up the callers who’re listening on the new QRG (or start working with a small split…)
  3. Send them NIL and hope they go away
  4. Work them to get them out of the way (and then, maybe, not log them)

With CW a small change in frequency can make a big difference. Just a matter of remembering that in the heat of an activation, and choosing the second rather than the first…

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You know, thinking about it, sometimes activators do not help chasers as much as perhaps they should. My favourite hate is the phone man who never says QRZ, in fact he says nothing, ends a contact with 73 and then - silence. Is he writing in his log, has he QSYd, has he packed up and gone home? Then after a loooong pause he calls CQ again and gets several replies. Rinse and repeat! He might be king, but some of his subjects get fed up and go away, there is often several other stations worth chasing, why waste time?

Another nuisance is the guy who calls “station ending in ZZ”, gets called by a station ending in YY on top of the ZZ, and works him. That is just begging for an unruly pile-up!

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Nature shows us that many things are “normally distributed” as the statisticians say. One can argue about the share of the leading and tailing end of the Gaussian distribution but it can be applied in many cases. In the positioning towards innovation you find fast followers, those who tend to wait and the ones who block (“we tried this before and it never worked…”). Musicians, motorists, managers, football coaches, politicians may be other examples.

I leave it up to you to make your own choice. :wink:

But let’s face it, the majority is more or less average (around the mean) and there are some in the leading end (playing the game close to perfection) and some in the tailing end (struggling). As a rule of thumb and according to my experience, both ends contribute with around 20 % each and the middle fraction with around 60 %. As said, shares may differ depending on the use case, but I have a suspicion that this general rule can also be applied to ham radio operators in general, regardles of their role (activator / chaser) in the SOTA programme. :face_with_raised_eyebrow:

The way to cope with it?

Tolerance and a common understanding that we all want to have fun with our hobby.

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Sometimes I forget in the hustle and bustle of working a pile-up, but I usually throw in a “/P ?” here and there to give the portable stations a better chance. 99.9% of the chasers are a good bunch and understand this and patiently wait.

73, Martin, PE1EEC

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That’s how I understand it too.

For example, when I was traveling with Kurt@HB9AFI in the pre-s2s SOTA time (he is a die-hard dxer and IOTAer), we always laughed heartily about such “outliers”, of course not without making fun of them a bit.

This somewhat sporty attitude hasn’t changed for me after the introduction of the s2s category.

So I could never understand why there is such an outcry over the last few years about the handling of s2s QSOs.

Why must s2s QSOs be offered to interested parties on the silver platter and always with first priority and always without any noise whatsoever?

For me, such s2s QSOs “degenerate” into pure routine and thus lose all excitement and all charm.

Seen from Gauss’ point of view, the topic addressed here may only be a “problem” for a few, which, however, make it all the more noticeable.

Please do not understand my thoughts as a reproach or instruction, but simply as a slightly different view.

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Just a quick Thank You!.. Today I worked 27 S2Ss. On quite a few QSOs, chasers alerted activators that I was trying to get through. It really helped and was really appreciated. My 10w went a long way!

73s

Martin

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The S2S category was more or less invented by the activators. It was seen as something rather special in the days when often there were fewer than ten activations in a day, and chasers willingly stood by to help the contacts along. The MT brought in the award because the activators wanted it. To my mind it is still special, two QRP stations with simple antennas contacting each other rather than the usually better equipped chasers. It may be a bit more routine now there are hundreds of activations per day, but it still has more flavour!

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At this time of year I have done all my local summits so I can’t get any more activation points. But I can still collect S2S points. I enjoy all the contacts with chasers but the S2S contacts always seem special.

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I think it’s all a matter of experience. With experience, it all gets easier.

I can remember the days when I too felt that frustration of not being able to get through with my QRP, and having to wait a long time to make a S2S. Nowadays, I seem to find it quite easy - yet I’m still operating with 5 watts and a homemade antenna! The only difference is that I am a more experienced and (hopefully) better operator.

Chasers responding to partials that don’t match is rather antisocial in my opinion. As an activator, I ignore them and persist in trying to complete with the station I’ve (partially) asked for. As Brian @g8add says, if you don’t do that, and instead call in the non-matching QRO station, you quickly lose control of your pile-up - as well as it being unfair on the stations operating considerately.

However, when I have heard this going on recently, it has involved activators newly licensed and new to SOTA. They are learning, and we need to cut them a bit of slack (and offer guidance).

In terms of the numbers it’s easier. In terms of the demand from chasers and even the competition from other currently-activating stations (especially at weekends), it’s tougher. My own numbers suggests that it is indeed easier now with big S2S totals being achieved from weekend activations - but then I also have the benefit of over 3700 activations behind me. I suspect I would have really struggled to make S2S contacts with current activity levels back in the days of my first few hundred activations!

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I feel the same way, Richard. :v:
The S2S contacts are all the more important to me. Over 3000 S2S points in the last three months :smiling_face:

73 Chris

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